Change revive HP to a percentage of full health rather then set amounts.


(PixelTwitch) #1

Simple as the title makes it sound really…

Obviously I will try and explain my reasoning a little bit here, with both sides of the argument. My first major reasoning behind such a change would be to help preserve the individuality between each of the Mercs straight after a revive. For instance, lets say that both the red team and the blue team have a Sparks that is going to tap revive one player each from there team that will duel it out in a 1v1. Currently, due to it being a set HP revive, if both players were revived at the exact same time the player that has the advantage going into a duel is the one with the fastest weapon, fastest movement or smallest hitbox (in most cases). This means a BLUE teams Rhino, Fragger or Thunder would all be at a disadvantage (or at least not have any advantage) vs a RED teams Proxy, Aura or Kira and I personally find this strange.

Let me be clear, I can see one reason behind why Splash Damage may have chosen to do things this way, maybe even 2-3 reasons at a push…

1, They purposely wanted to make this situation not an advantage to higher HP Mercs.
2, Offsets how easy to down low HP Mercs are.
3, Consistancy for the person doing the revive.

All of these are fine reasons and there is nothing inherently wrong with the way things are done now. It’s just, I believe doing percentages would be better for a few reasons.

1, I believe a tank for the most part should maintain their advantage through a revive.
2, You get out exactly what you put in as a Medic.
3, It helps offset the already easy to gib high HP characters.
4, Helps offset hit box size.
5. Helps offset speed.

The overall difference would not be as “crazy” as it may seem. For instance it would work out like a tap revive that would give Aura 20hp would give Thunder 40hp. The biggest difference I suppose would be the value of charging defibs because 1 second charge may be worth 60hp on Aura and 120hp on Thunder.

To reduce this, you could have a tap revive be like 30hp on all Mercs with the percentage value only being applied to extra charge (and I really like this idea). So a tap would be 30hp on Aura and 30hp on Thunder but a 1 second charge would be 70hp for Aura and 110hp for Thunder, so you would maintain but keep control of the higher hp advantage.


(Mustang) #2

The reason it was changed from a percentage to a set HP was that high HP mercs take longer to kill and yet they could be instantly brought back to full HP so medics weren’t medicing, but rather just following a heavy around with fully charged paddles and insta-reviving back to full HP the second he went down, it was this zero downtime and OP revive train pocket medicing they wanted to nerf.

I feel like you almost mentioned this, but not quite, so thought I’d throw it in there.

They could do a half-way house between set HP and %, but as it is right now each side has it’s trade-offs rather than one being clearly superiour, so it doesn’t bother me massively how it works right now.


(PixelTwitch) #3

Basically yea, then the released sparks and totally messed that up with her stupidly high revive HP.
I do think that its ok to not have 100% revives as a thing. Even just having it cap out at 75HP with a set HP for a tap revive would control some of that revive training down.


(fubar) #4

ET Revives pls :< half hp, always. Never more, never less. Player is immediately invulnerable and put into a stasis that does not allow him to perform any movement action for 2 seconds. Also no bullet penetration, can be used as shield by the Reviver. Limited amount of revives per life (can be replenished with ammo).


(PixelTwitch) #5

lol the 50% hp sounds fine but I have to admit I honestly feel like any and all revive invulnerability is always fully retarded. I hate it more then almost anything and its likely in my top 3 things I wish would be removed from DB along with MG Nests and the Loadout card system >.<


(fubar) #6

I agree, but the fact that they can not do anything while being invulnerable cancels it out, but still has a use and purpose over instantly dropping before you even finish your get up animation, that’s just silly to me. I’ve always hated the bf3/4 revives. It doesn’t give you any real time or even chance to prepare yourself to get back into the fight either, very likely you’re out of ammo as well and first thing having to switch guns, or reload while taking damage is utterly annoying. :stuck_out_tongue:


(PixelTwitch) #7

One thing that BF3/4 did do right (in my opinion) was giving you the option to decline a revive or “wait” to get up.
So you are actually alive again but still on the floor and standing up (space) is basically the accept.

See the problem with using an invisible player as a shield is that the person shooting you may as well be firing into the sky.
I stuck with my stance on saying if you are going to make someone invul they should NOT have bullet collision so you can kill the medic. If you want to have people be able to use revived players as shields them sheilds should take damage. (even if its a reduced amount in place of the invul) I would be totally fine with having revived players be able to participate in a fight and take 50% less damage for 1-3 seconds.

In some ways this is all about personal preference but in one other way I feel its about concept.
I don’t like the concept that you can ever waste bullets shooting at an invincible target ESPECIALLY like in DB where the revived target gets 1 free shot when he chooses to take part in a fight. To prevent that free shot you need to spam bullets at him and them bullets are basically wasted. Hence my stance :slight_smile:


(Kendle) #8

I look at it from the point of view of the Medic, as someone who played Medic most of the time in RTCW / ET.

If I’m expected to run into a combat situation, with no way of defending myself (paddles are out) and the team-mate I revive has no way of defending himself (can take damage whilst disorientated + possible need to reload) I want to know my efforts won’t be wasted. Yes, as Medic I need to pick and choose when to attempt a revive and when not to, running into the middle of an on-going fire-fight paddles out is stupid, but waiting for the perfectly safe moment usually means your team-mate is gibbed, so there’s always some trade off between risk and reward.

There was a time in the Alpha / Beta when there was no revive shield (of any worth) and so no-one revived (why would they?). We can’t lose the revive shield IMO, or else we lose Medics, all we can do is balance it, and not being able to engage whilst being invulnerable seems to me an elegant solution (for how long might be debatable). If you don’t like wasting bullets on invincible players make sure you gib them when you put them down.

I’m not sure where I stand on the HP -vs- % thing tho, but I think it’s Sparks that muddies the waters here, not the revive mechanic as such. I’d rather balance Sparks than make reviving a pointless exercise for every other Medic.


(Apples) #9

A very (very!) short invul shield which goes instantly off if the revived player shoot can be a good one (if it is not already the case, didnt pay much attention to this), this way you can at least reorient, start the reload while invul and you can engage after that.

As for the percentage thingie, I think the “middle way” i.e. = fixed amount + a little % would be the less biased way, because being the quickest / fastest is an advantage when you drop on someone, but if a tank and a tiny get revived each with 50 hp in front of each other I’m not sure the tiny will still have the advantage as the tank can already track head, not saying it ont be the case, just saying that it might not be a black / white as you described. Thats why yeah, I like your idea of fixed + % on revive, this way tanks are not buffed too much, neither are tinies and the % part can be tweaked easily to see what works best.


(Rémy Cabresin) #10

This is just another where Sparks is the problem and not medics as a whole. Weve already gotten nerfs to all medica because of her and that **** needs to stop. Balance Sparks when Sparks is the problem… I honestly dont understand how a merc can be faster(no need to switch to paddles etc), safer(sitting in the back forever), better(charging revive is faster at giving big health) at reviving AND on top of that have something that 1 hit kills things. Whoever thought/thinks that is balanced needs to get their head checked…


(alphabeta) #11

+10 fer sure. Sparks is single most OP merc bar none


(PixelTwitch) #12

I also agree, just too scared to push for anything because I don’t trust SD to balance her correctly in a way that keeps her both fun and viable.
Limited with what you can do when simply tweaking the odd number here and there.

Values don’t fix broken mechanics.


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