is sd throwing a chance?


(attack) #1

i noticed today that now a game called wrack is on steam early access.which let me ask myself, if maybe the old school shooters make their way back. it looks like there is a big market for these kind of games. some examples which were realeased or will soon:rise of the triad , reborn, shadow warrior, to name the most famous.

there is a rising market for these kind of games:
as an example RotT was a succes, even with not good critics.

so why not simply do smth rly different of all this cod clones?

dont get me wrong xt isnt a bad game, but it doesn’t separate itself enough from all cod clones to be succesfull.

P.S wrack and RotT have a map editor


(shaftz0r) #2

RotT is terrible with a capital T, but i do agree with this thread. People do want the old school shooters back. There isnt a massive market, and never will be again, but enough to make it salient


(Ruben0s) #3

I’m waiting for new ww2 game with battlefield 4 graphics. I’m bored of the modern day game styles.


(attack) #4

ye maybe not that big like the cod and bf market, but as there is no other AAA title which goes in this branch. there aree many players which witing on smth new . (ut3 players as example).as SD would nearly be the only provider, i see for xT on this market a bigger chance than on the mainstream.
with steam machines,steam os and mantle hopefully the pc market will even more growing and faster shooters can be succesfull again.

tribes as example had about 1 million beta testers.


(attack) #5

everybody is.same with zombies.the creativity is a shame nowadays.i would like more spacesettings.no need of ww2 again


(INF3RN0) #6

DayZ is the only original game I’ve played in the last few years, and it was just a mod ffs. Originality is where it’s at and I’d give up playing the same regurgitated games I’ve played for years for more originals.


(.N.E.R.D.) #7

There are always good new original games, you just gotta buy the top indie games on steam :wink: When it comes to shooters there are new things here and there but ppl seem to prefer the old stuff.


(shaftz0r) #8

i had a blast with hard reset just as an example of something more in the old school category


(Rex) #9

New things? Where?

http://www.cigames.com/en/Games/Enemy-Front :wink:


(Ashog) #10

I also think there are no new things.

The Hard Reset from what I have played last was pretty much the most stupifying and boring game tbh.

The Enemy Front looks interesting. When does it come out?


(stealth6) #11

[QUOTE=Ashog;481701]I also think there are no new things.

The Hard Reset from what I have played last was pretty much the most stupifying and boring game tbh.

The Enemy Front looks interesting. When does it come out?[/QUOTE]

From their FB page: http://www.vg247.com/2013/08/31/enemy-front-to-be-released-by-city-interactive-in-spring-2014/

(Spring 2014)


(shaftz0r) #12

[QUOTE=Ashog;481701]I also think there are no new things.

The Hard Reset from what I have played last was pretty much the most stupifying and boring game tbh.

The Enemy Front looks interesting. When does it come out?[/QUOTE]

im guessing you cant aim? its an old school arcady type shooter. not overly long, but pretty intense


(Protekt1) #13

The problem with these small indie MP games are that they are terrible, absolutely terrible, at sustaining a player base. I am not buying it for that concern. Wrack has a better chance because it has a SP component at least as well as map tools. Maybe if it has an active population in a couple months I will revisit my decision.

edit:

Oh wait ****… I could have swore there was MP in the game. Wrack has no MP and the devs do not plan or intend to add it (a very definitive, very little room for change, not going to happen response when asked). In their faqs - Q5: Will Wrack have multiplayer?
A5: Sadly, no. As an indie developer, it’s taken every ounce of our efforts and resources just to get a single player FPS off the ground. To really do it right would add months - if not years - to the project’s development time, and time is not a luxury we have. We don’t believe in half-assing anything, so we’d rather save that for later instead of giving you a mediocre experience right now. Our plan is to do something similar to what Torchlight is doing and save multiplayer for the sequel - if we get that far, of course!

So basically they intend to make money off the SP campaign, then make money off of DLC, then make wrack 2 with MP.

I’m definitely not buying wrack 1.


(RasteRayzeR) #14

I agree with OP, and I find really discouraging this mentality SD has to think that players can’t handle more difficulties in a game than the average COD. I really want a game with tricks and a long learning curve, something without this obsession to make a game realistic (what’s the point to play something you can simply do IRL ?). I’d believe SD is a bit afraid to get the same results as with brink and they chose to remain generic / COD style to ensure a minimum of people will play the game.

However COD has no performances issues, a lot of maps, a wide 13 years old community and console support. I regret that SD is “only tweaking” the current state of the game and keeps the bugs and bad design choices along from release to release. In the end I fear for this game if simple changes are not taken into account seriously :

  • Movement : it’s already better we can go faster, but most 2D games are based either on physics or on trick movements with a nice mechanic, and it’s enough to make a game more addictive than XT at the moment. There is no distinct movement style in XT right now and this is a wasted opportunity IMO to make the game unique.
  • Firing : LOUDER ! More impressive, go nuts with the explosions and stuff ! Don’t fall in the pitfall of doing a serious game with seriously depressing gameplay.
  • Gunplay : just meh. I find it inconsistent and this kills me : with the shotgun and Proxi I can shoot down a guy with 1 headshot, but it takes 4 close range body shots to gib ? Or I need 4 close range body shots to kill a soldier ? Come on … And I agree with whoever said the game lacks weapon diversity. You should maybe explore different types of projectiles (not only bullets or grenades). Speaking of grenades, we really lack the crowd control stuff. Right now the whole gameplay is based on a few key abilities (air strikes, mines (at least for me), molotovs) and mostly gunplay.
  • Maps : XT clearly lacks secondary objectives that have a direct impact on main objectives. This would solve IMO the linearity problem of the maps.
  • Characters : need two abilities per character. One is not enough to really make them hard to choose from depending on the situation (unless one char has a broken ability during current patch).
  • General considerations : remove the pigeons and rats or make them shootable … lol

XT right now is not so playable, I have a lot of fun with the guys during the drafts because we have a controlled environment, but I’m getting tired of playing the same 3 maps on and on. Waterloo is the only one that has a memorable and epic objective : the last stage (most fun I ever had in XT). I’m waiting to see what the next updates will bring, and I hope for new maps in the normal rotation and a more immersive game/gun-play. Mostly : meaningful secondary objectives to give depth to the recons and soldiers. Right now it’s just shooting and dying.

I recently enlisted in Star Citizen because their philosophy is that the PC is THE console with the best controls and performances. It’s the “real” gamer’s choice and seeing that XT will be only for PC was a motivation for me to get involved. I’m not developing this game and I would probably be terrible at it, but I know that the gamers either get what they want or leave, and I don’t wanna leave XT.


(Rex) #15

[QUOTE=RasteRayzeR;481788]I agree with OP, and I find really discouraging this mentality SD has to think that players can’t handle more difficulties in a game than the average COD. I really want a game with tricks and a long learning curve, something without this obsession to make a game realistic (what’s the point to play something you can simply do IRL ?). I’d believe SD is a bit afraid to get the same results as with brink and they chose to remain generic / COD style to ensure a minimum of people will play the game.

However COD has no performances issues, a lot of maps, a wide 13 years old community and console support. I regret that SD is “only tweaking” the current state of the game and keeps the bugs and bad design choices along from release to release. In the end I fear for this game if simple changes are not taken into account seriously :

  • Movement : it’s already better we can go faster, but most 2D games are based either on physics or on trick movements with a nice mechanic, and it’s enough to make a game more addictive than XT at the moment. There is no distinct movement style in XT right now and this is a wasted opportunity IMO to make the game unique.
  • Firing : LOUDER ! More impressive, go nuts with the explosions and stuff ! Don’t fall in the pitfall of doing a serious game with seriously depressing gameplay.
  • Gunplay : just meh. I find it inconsistent and this kills me : with the shotgun and Proxi I can shoot down a guy with 1 headshot, but it takes 4 close range body shots to gib ? Or I need 4 close range body shots to kill a soldier ? Come on … And I agree with whoever said the game lacks weapon diversity. You should maybe explore different types of projectiles (not only bullets or grenades). Speaking of grenades, we really lack the crowd control stuff. Right now the whole gameplay is based on a few key abilities (air strikes, mines (at least for me), molotovs) and mostly gunplay.
  • Maps : XT clearly lacks secondary objectives that have a direct impact on main objectives. This would solve IMO the linearity problem of the maps.
  • Characters : need two abilities per character. One is not enough to really make them hard to choose from depending on the situation (unless one char has a broken ability during current patch).
  • General considerations : remove the pigeons and rats or make them shootable … lol

XT right now is not so playable, I have a lot of fun with the guys during the drafts because we have a controlled environment, but I’m getting tired of playing the same 3 maps on and on. Waterloo is the only one that has a memorable and epic objective : the last stage (most fun I ever had in XT). I’m waiting to see what the next updates will bring, and I hope for new maps in the normal rotation and a more immersive game/gun-play. Mostly : meaningful secondary objectives to give depth to the recons and soldiers. Right now it’s just shooting and dying.

I recently enlisted in Star Citizen because their philosophy is that the PC is THE console with the best controls and performances. It’s the “real” gamer’s choice and seeing that XT will be only for PC was a motivation for me to get involved. I’m not developing this game and I would probably be terrible at it, but I know that the gamers either get what they want or leave, and I don’t wanna leave XT.[/QUOTE]

Good post and apart from “Waterloo last stage most fun” I agree on everything, though all I can say is: Once again…


(attack) #16

[QUOTE=Protekt1;481759]

edit:

Oh wait ****… I could have swore there was MP in the game. Wrack has no MP and the devs do not plan or intend to add it (a very definitive, very little room for change, not going to happen response when asked). In their faqs - Q5: Will Wrack have multiplayer?
A5: Sadly, no. As an indie developer, it’s taken every ounce of our efforts and resources just to get a single player FPS off the ground. To really do it right would add months - if not years - to the project’s development time, and time is not a luxury we have. We don’t believe in half-assing anything, so we’d rather save that for later instead of giving you a mediocre experience right now. Our plan is to do something similar to what Torchlight is doing and save multiplayer for the sequel - if we get that far, of course!

So basically they intend to make money off the SP campaign, then make money off of DLC, then make wrack 2 with MP.

I’m definitely not buying wrack 1.[/QUOTE]

i noticed it late too :/.but i have respect for their decision.most games throw in a multiplayer only to have one.
that bring a multiplayer in the second game can be fine has games like torchlight shown us.
sometimes you have simply invest in smth that pays of first in some years.

its a fair price.
you get a mapeditor ! and a timeattack mode.(kind of multiplayer i think)


(tangoliber) #17

RotT and Shadow Warrior reboots are really fun. Tower of Guns is my favorite game of this year.
Wrack has the right idea…just needs more interesting projectile patterns for enemies. Hard to inspire people to design levels for it when there are only melee, straight projectile, and homing projectile enemies available.


(attack) #18

the problem is that SD mostly uses already existing weapons and not design much new ones


(DarkangelUK) #19

One weapon from the old games that I think would fit is the FG42 from ET. Short range scope, low firing rate, low clip size, high damage… I loved it.


(shaftz0r) #20

you forgot high spread. that was the only weapon in et that had any discernible spread, and it was intense